Ken Casey Of Dropkick Murphys On The Importance Of Speaking Out In Song

Forbes contributors publish independent expert analyses and insights. The folk tradition has long been defined by incredible storytelling, a genre of music that has consistently delivered well-crafted, timeless songs that address the world in an effort to provoke conversation and beget change. Punk rock has similarly touted a socially conscious spirit, with Ronald Reagan acting as a particular source of derision in America in the 80s. Growing up in the suburbs of Boston, Dropkick Murphys singer and bassist Ken Casey was exposed to all of it. The latest Dropkick Murphys single "Citizen I.C.E.," which masterfully reworks the lyrics to the group's 2005 single "Citizen C.I.A.," tackles tumultuous times in America. The cut appears on the new split EP New England Forever, which finds the Dropkick Murphys sharing wax with Boston-based hardcore punks Haywire on a collaborative throwback EP featuring two new tracks from each act alongside covers and more. Speaking and singing on behalf of unions and worker's rights, the Dropkick Murphys have advocated for the little guy for three decades, which renders the band particularly adept at addressing MAGA era policies that continue to have a profound impact on working class Americans. While recent reaction amongst fans has been mixed, the band has nevertheless managed to provoke conversation in a way largely unparalleled throughout popular music today. Attending a House hearing last year, former Washington, D.C. Metropolitan Police Officer Michael Fanone, who defended the Capitol during the January 6 insurrection in 2021, wound up in confrontation with an election conspiracy theorist while clad in a Dropkick Murphys t-shirt bearing the Woody Guthrie-inspired message "Fighting Nazis Since 1996." In 2024, during a performance on stage in Florida, Casey paused the show to challenge a fan situated near the stage in a MAGA t-shirt, betting him that the Make America Great Again garment was manufactured outside the United States. Spoiler alert: the MAGA shirt was made in Nicaragua (though Dropkick Murphys shirts are actually made in the USA). Taking their message directly to fans, the band also performed a free acoustic set in Minneapolis last month, supporting local relief efforts while honoring Alex Pretti and Renee Good, both of whom were killed by federal agents. Joining similarly-minded artists like folk singer Billy Bragg (who appeared on the most recent Dropkicks studio effort, 2025's For The People) and rocker Bruce Springsteen, the Dropkick Murphys find placement near the top of a shockingly small list of contemporary artists speaking out in song. "Listen, if watching citizens get executed isn't enough to make you write a song, what is? If the Epstein files aren't? If another useless war isn't? I think they're gonna come pouring off the sidelines now," said Casey prior to a recent Dropkick Murphys performance in Chicago (the band returns to the road in June, heading abroad through August). "I'm not gonna shame anyone for jumping in late. Jump in whenever you're ready. But it's time to take back a little bit of the narrative. Let's be the ones that help make it uncomfortable for people to behave the way they have been in public," he said. "I'd just love to see America get back to having some class and dignity again at the very least, you know?" I spoke with Ken Casey about embracing the folk and punk tradition, the importance of speaking out in song, the new Dropkick Murphys/Haywire split EP New England Forever and what he learned during a recent visit to Ukraine. A transcript of our conversation, lightly edited for length and clarity, follows below. Jim Ryan: Going all the way back to the folk tradition, music has been a great way of addressing the world, begetting a productive conversation. Growing up, every punk band I'd come to love was writing songs about Reagan. Reagan gets a mention in one of the first lyrics to one of the first Dropkick Murphys songs. So, what was inspiring you early on? Was it the folk tradition, those punk acts... Ken Casey: Oh, it was both. But the punk stuff was by choice as a rebellious teenager. The folk stuff was by osmosis from surroundings and family. Both of them, in a lot of ways, had their own similarities. One was singing about an oppressive government from outside and one was singing about a government from within. Speaking more about America, you can draw those comparisons directly from what Reagan started with allowing our media to become what it is. Rolling back the taxes on the ultra wealthy, dismantling unions. It's all to break the backs of regular people and to divide working people (which is the same old playbook throughout time, really). And here we are today. Just such an ultra extreme level of that. Which, ironically, not to jump too far ahead, makes me wonder, how is every punk band not singing about it now? Ryan: That has been the strangest thing to me. There's been a few finally recently. But, by and large, I keep looking around going, "Where are the songs?" Where were you finding those type of folk songs pre-internet? Casey: The patriarch or matriarch of every family that I knew was from Ireland, whether it was the parents or the grandparents. So, at every social event, every occasion when you were a teenager and could get into the bars. There was a famous club called the Beachcomber in Quincy, Massachusetts which was famous for bringing over big Irish acts to play in a very small venue. So, I don't know that I had to go looking for folk music, you know? I went looking for punk. I was looking for punk in fanzines. And when you found a band you loved, seeing what bands they thanked in their liner notes and checking them out. To me, that was the greatest. If someone handed you punk on a silver platter, like you could get today, it would have taken away what was so special about it to me, you know? Ryan: It's amazing how well the new "Citizen I.C.E." lyrics speak to the original. What what was it like putting a new spin on "Citizen C.I.A.?" Casey: I was just doing it live one night and changed it on the fly. And then, obviously, I worked a little harder on tweaking the lyrics. The original was a similar song. But it was just a little more tongue-in-cheek. Because we all know the C.I.A. meddles in regime change and has caused so much havoc around the world. But it's not as blatantly in our face I guess. That was still a political statement. But not as urgent. Changing it to "Citizen I.C.E." was a much more urgent situation. And people have really rallied to it. Because most of the other songs that have been written in this immediate time have been written on more the folkier side, you know? Ryan: You mentioned the idea of the fanzine. And obviously the new EP, a split EP like that, is kind of a throwback too. What's it been like touring with Haywire and putting together the new EP with them? Casey: It's been a long time since a band has come along that reminded me of just how much Dropkick Murphys was balls to the wall at that era of our career. They're only two years in. But just the split EPs and the making your own flyers and playing anywhere and everywhere that'll have you? It's kind of lit a fire under our ass. So, it's been a match made in heaven. But it's kind of ironic that it's happening right on our 30 years, which is a nostalgic time for us anyway. But to be able to kind of go back and do things like split records and stuff? That's how we got our start. So, it's nice to be back 30 years in doing it again and knowing that the next generation is still carrying the ball. Ryan: I watched the I.C.E. stuff when it was going on here in Chicago and couldn't possibly imagine it would get even worse in Minneapolis. We saw Springsteen and Tom Morello and Rise Against speak up and perform there. How important is it to get up there and touch base with those fans in an intimate way like that and let them know you're present and actually thinking about this stuff? Casey: There are multiple reasons we wanted to do it. One is to help raise money for those in need and help bring some people back to the neighborhood. From my understanding, those businesses have been devastated. Two is to be able to stand on stage and tell the people of Minneapolis and Minnesota how proud they made America. That we all watched how they stood up and faced this. And it created a sense of what I would call real patriotism. And to just say that we don't have to back down and give up to this. So, I think it's important to go up and say that. And my third reason is similar to how I felt going to the 9/11 memorial for the first time. If you can be there with your own eyes to testify and see in that spot that, to me, will go down in history where we watched two Americans executed by our government. I think every American should, if they get a chance to go, not just settle for seeing it on TV and go to pay your respects. Ryan: How about the Down for the Cause initiative that you've partnered with Rise Against on? What can you tell me about that? Casey: Yeah, we haven't really rolled it out yet. We're trying to decide how we want to roll it out, whether it would be a tour or one off show. Whether there would be more focus on voting stuff. But the idea was to help some other bands off the sidelines. Getting back to what I mentioned in the first sentence of the interview, the reason why I think a lot of bands sang about Reagan, but they don't sing now, is because Reagan didn't have an army of trolls to try to suppress you and bully you. And my comment for those people who are worrying about that is that half of them are bots. Half of them are also people that I wouldn't f-ing want at my show anyway. You know what I mean? Just flat out racists that used to be hiding under a rock right before this scumbag president let them out to behave this way in public. I still have hope some of these people will come back to their senses and realize that this man has done nothing but divide us. Because I do think there is that element of the fact that your political view could be shaped by something as simple as what is your father watching on the news in your house? What's the topic of conversation at your dinner table between the algorithm and your immediate surroundings? Sometimes, you don't even hear the other side. I'm not gonna mention who it is. But there's someone that I know that is in a pretty big band. An individual in the band is speaking out. And, the minute they started, the floodgates opened. The hate was unbelievable. They punched themselves out. Not literally. When I say "punch themselves out," I mean with their keyboard warrior fingers. But Dropkick Murphys have been there already, right? So it's just like, who gives a s-t? It doesn't affect your business. I'll tell you that. We were told we were canceled all the time! And we're still here. I'm not saying it's made us a bigger band. But I think a lot of our fan base has rallied around us more. And there's more of an energy and importance to the shows. People appreciate the fact that we are taking the more difficult path. Obviously, it's way easier to mind your own business. But that's what an authoritarian wants and counts on is for everyone to just keep their head down and say, "I don't want the target on my back!" I look at it like this: if you don't got a target on your back, you're not doing enough. Ryan: You guys had two really interesting moments in the last few years. There was the Dropkick Murphys t-shirt at the House hearing. There was also the made in Nicaragua t-shirt in your live crowd. What was fascinating about both of those moments was that in this world where everything just seems so contrived, those were both organic moments. Was it heartening to see that you could bring some levity to a situation like that in an organic way? Casey: Yeah. If stuff's gonna go viral, it's nice that it's not just a TikTok dance once in a while. But, man, both of those did go viral. The first incident - challenging a fan to see if his MAGA shirt was made in America - I think people really gravitated to that because it cut to the core of the matter in a real factual way. Because so much of this MAGA versus normal people thing is this hyperbole. Right? You can debate facts. But your shirt says "Make America Great." Well, what does the tag say? "Made in Nicaragua." How is that making America great? But another thing people liked about that interaction was that it wasn't hostile. And I'll be the first to say, depending on how I'm approached, I can be hostile back! Sometimes, when you wade into the fire, man, you can get it from both sides! But it's humanity. You know what I mean? If we can't have a conversation... Do you want to just automatically have a civil war? Let's at least try to settle this as people. And people, for the most part, I think, liked that we were trying to have an actual conversation. And then, in the end, when I proved this guy wrong - and for MAGA, this is a big thing - he accepted it. They never accept it! They double down or triple down. So, to see him just say, "OK." I mean, I'm not saying he necessarily turned around and voted for Kamala or whatever, but it was a lesson. And then the Michael Fanone thing, with the shirt in Congress... He's an old punk. He was at our first ever Washington, D.C. show. So, it was organic. He's a fan. And he was wearing the shirt because that shirt says "fighting Nazis since '96" on the back. People don't understand sometimes what that means. But, in our early days in the underground punk skinhead scene, and us being pretty open about being staunchly anti-racist, we had a lot of Nazi skinheads showing up at shows looking for us! And it wasn't hyperbole online back then. Like, it was in the alley, you know? I think a lot of MAGA doesn't understand that one. But I think that people like the bluntness of that statement: fighting Nazis since '96. That's when we started. That's what we've been about. And that's what we're doing! Maybe it was in the alley before but now it's maybe in the halls of Congress, which is crazy. Sometimes, I'll see bands. And their version of speaking out is like directing it towards the Nazis in the scene. But the Nazis aren't in the scene anymore! They were bottom-feeding back then. That's where they would look to come and try to siphon off some gullible kids. Well, now they're going to college campuses. Now they're in the White House! They don't need to bother with the punk scene anymore, you know? And it's true. Because you don't really see it in the punk scene at all anymore. It's gone mainstream. Ryan: I was reading about the Claddagh Fund earlier. When you collect money via the band's charitable arm, you're kind of seeing through the distribution of those funds locally, right? That's so rare. Casey: We distribute to other nonprofits that we see that are very organic with low overhead. We also help direct people to treatment and whatnot. And the treatment places we use are all non-insurance based, non-medical based. It's basically 12 step abstinence-based. Because a lot of us are in long term recovery. And the band kind of took its name from an old dry out spot. People always think, "Oh man, Dropkick Murphy's, a big drinking band!" No. I was sober before the band started. A lot of these stories about drinking were actually my horror show tales from the 80s. But, in keeping with our intent to not just raise funds to just go to help someone make a salary in the recovery side of things, we try to keep it to places that are really altruistic. Another thing is the recovery world, thanks to big pharma, has become, send someone to treatment so they can get put on every medicine under the sun. So, we try to be pretty hands on with not just sending them to treatment but also kind of helping them network and navigate the transition back home and stuff. It would seem like a pointless exercise if all we were doing is just writing a check to the blind. Ryan: Similarly, you didn't just speak about Ukraine, you actually visited Ukraine - during a war. What did you learn in Ukraine that you're able to kind of carry forward and apply during tumultuous times like these? Casey: Well, something I already knew: you gotta put your money where your mouth is. If you're gonna ask people to get involved in causes you are passionate about, you actually gotta do it. Talk is cheap. And I knew that. And going to Ukraine I knew would back up a lot of the things we were advocating for. But it still outweighed my expectations. Just the resiliency of the people, the kindness. When we crossed the border, I was driving an ambulance. Ambulances are one of the most targeted vehicles for drone strikes. Because they're looking to hurt who's in the ambulance and they look at it as that's one less thing they can care for (which is a war crime, by the way, to target an ambulance). Well, right when we crossed the border into Ukraine, there were lines of people waving. How much they got from seeing that Americans still cared. Especially watching the news and watching how their leader was treated at the White House. But there was also drone attacks almost every night. You'd hear that sound of the Shahed drone. A lot of times they're buzzing over looking for a target and whatnot. You'd hear explosions. I generally didn't know whether it was a drone landing or an anti-aircraft shooting the drone out. But then, come the morning, everyone's going about their day! Like it's a regular bustling city! And what the people would say is, "This war's been going on for years. At some point, you can't just hide in your basement. You have to go out and live life." Even for me, it was the same thing the first few nights. You had an app that would tell you whether it was a drone or a missile. If it hits your hotel, a drone's gonna take out a couple of rooms. A missile might take out a couple of floors or the whole building. So, you'd look at the app! Well, the first night I went in the shelter. And then the second night there was a missile. So, I went down to the shelter for a minute. I was there for a week. Well, by the third night, I was just saying, "F-k it, I'm sleeping!" What are you gonna do? But I was very impressed by the Ukrainian people. I understand, especially right now, that Americans are so sick of spending money on foreign wars, you know? Remember when NATO was supposed to have meant something not all that long ago? And, in our relations, and talking to all the people we know in Europe, and just to see how worried they are that that encroachment was just gonna keep coming? It just felt so different than going over and indiscriminately having America bomb another country. You know what I mean? Look, I don't care what your beliefs are politically. But to see the leader of our nation talk down to someone and talk about how they're not wearing a f--g suit? That's in the top 10 list of the most disgraceful things I've ever heard. So, I'd just love to see America get back to having some class and dignity again at the very least, you know?